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Generals take 2

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Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Chaotic good
Posted on March 6, 2011 at 6:42 pm

In sandbox Ive noticed you only get x amount of generals to use. If you want to play as a smaller faction i.e kingdom Crete, i think you only get 5 generals, and only 2 worth noting. I believe there should be an option that once you take over an enemies home city, you should get the option of employing them into your services. Would this be an easy option to apply to the game???

Level 8 Human Paladin
Alignment: Lawful good
Posted on March 6, 2011 at 8:35 pm

What was keeping you from bumping your original topic?

Anyway, you're saying to force captured generals into your service. That's not exactly the type of position you want to force people into, as they would make terrible leaders.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Chaotic good
Posted on March 7, 2011 at 12:25 am

What was keeping you from bumping your original topic?

Anyway, you're saying to force captured generals into your service. That's not exactly the type of position you want to force people into, as they would make terrible leaders.


the fact that no one has replied to what i think is a pretty fair question in over 2 weeks maybe...

And in the sandbox area of the game, why not have the option of forcing them or paying them in gold? Its not exactly fair that if you want to play as a minority faction than you are forced to do with a select number of generals without the prospect of gaining a few in the future. This post is not about flaming or hating. I wrote it in the hope of addressing this issue.

Level 8 Human Paladin
Alignment: Lawful good
Posted on March 7, 2011 at 1:29 pm

But you answered your question yourself: you're playing minor powers. Minor powers, by their nature, present a challenge different from major factions. In the end, if you allowed extra generals, the only thing that would be different is that you started out in a smaller region than other factions. You would be a minor power in name only, and you may as well play with a larger faction.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Chaotic good
Posted on March 7, 2011 at 5:43 pm

You are missing my point entirely lol. If you start off as a mino and start carving out a decent empire, then naturally that faction should in turn attract generals to its service due to the rising power of the faction. It is natural to see an army's retinue grow with power, i.e Alexanders army expanded substantially both with man power and leadership, once he started sweeping away the old Persian empire. this was due to defectors, integrating Persian nobles as well as a larger man power pool to draw on due to newly conquered territories. I just think it would be an interesting option, that's all.

Level 8 Human Paladin
Alignment: Lawful good
Posted on March 7, 2011 at 6:46 pm

Hmm, I see now. They'd have to add in more spawn triggers for factions other than Macedonia. Might be able to mod them in yourself, actually, though it'd be nice to have a construction set of sorts like with TES.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Chaotic good
Posted on March 7, 2011 at 9:49 pm

Hmm, I see now. They'd have to add in more spawn triggers for factions other than Macedonia. Might be able to mod them in yourself, actually, though it'd be nice to have a construction set of sorts like with TES.

Thats pretty much spot on :) Sorry, im not really that good about bringing my point across in writing.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Chaotic good
Posted on March 8, 2011 at 12:06 pm

There should be some way to get more generals in the Sandbox campaign, I agree. They might be tied to the number of cities you control, or they could be part of the royal family (i.e. your faction leader has kids, they grow up and become generals), or they might be a recruitable (and expensive) unit. This is one area that the Total War games tend to do pretty well, especially Rome and Medieval.

I also think generals should be able to die, at least in the Sandbox mode -- perhaps they get a certain number of 'lives' before they expire? It would also be pretty cool if they gradually increased their skills as they got experience.

Level 8 Human Sage
Alignment: Chaotic good
Location: Great Britain
Posted on March 8, 2011 at 4:10 pm

What was keeping you from bumping your original topic?
the fact that no one has replied to what i think is a pretty fair question in over 2 weeks maybe...


"bumping" means posting a reply to a topic (either your own or someone elses) purely to bring it back to the top of the forum and bring attention back to it. you could have just replied to your own original post instead of reposting. its no big deal its just easier for all concerned including yourself.

Level 8 Human Hegemon
Alignment: Lawful good
Location: PA, USA
Posted on March 8, 2011 at 8:02 pm

I also think generals should be able to die, at least in the Sandbox mode -- perhaps they get a certain number of 'lives' before they expire? It would also be pretty cool if they gradually increased their skills as they got experience.

I like the idea that generals can gain experience, just like units. This also brings up a question I have about generals. If they are placed in command of a unit and their stat in a particular category, combined with the unit's, is over 5 is the excess wasted? I can't play the game now to confirm but I believe it is.
Maybe there should be a total of ten total experience points and both a unit and general contributes to it. The bonuses these points provide should probably increase at a decreasing rate as it approaches ten.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Chaotic good
Posted on March 9, 2011 at 6:33 am

I'm not sure, but I think the unit gets either its own skill number or the general's, whichever is higher. I don't think the two are added.

Level 8 Human Sage
Alignment: Chaotic good
Location: Great Britain
Posted on March 9, 2011 at 7:21 am

the units skill and the generals skill are added, presumably up to a max of 10 for each skill, as there's no mention of it being the higher of the 2, or capped at 5.
from the manual: [Generals]... Add skills (heroics, initiative, logistics, and engineering) to the skills of the unit merged with

however, when you have more than one general attached to a unit. then only the higher of each skill is applied. for example, a general with 4,4,1,1 plus a general with 1,1,4,4, would be equal to a general with 4,4,4,4 and added to the units stats as such.
from the manual: Multiple generals can merge with a single unit, but their skills do not accumulate. Only the best general in each skill has an effect on the unit they are merged with

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Chaotic good
Posted on March 9, 2011 at 8:25 am

Hmmm, well then the interface is sort of confusing (at least to me) because it shows the two ratings separately, I don't think it shows the combined total anywhere, does it? That would be useful info to have at a glance without having to mentally add up the stars...

Level 8 Human Paladin
Alignment: Lawful good
Posted on March 9, 2011 at 4:01 pm

How hard is it to add 13 and 50? I mean, they're all very basic, easy to add numbers. :\

Also, it does show the overall total for morale, adding both the general's and the unit's skill to the default morale.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Chaotic good
Posted on March 9, 2011 at 4:31 pm

I did not know there would be math in this game! But seriously, forcing the player to do sums in his head when he's playing a computer game does not, to me, seem to be a good design decision, regardless of how simple the calculations. And the fact that I've put in 50 hours assuming the game went with the higher figure since it doesn't add them. I can't be the only one who finds it confusing.

Level 8 Human Truffle Farmer
Alignment: Good
Location: Australia
Posted on March 14, 2011 at 10:43 am

I did not know there would be math in this game! But seriously, forcing the player to do sums in his head when he's playing a computer game does not, to me, seem to be a good design decision, regardless of how simple the calculations. And the fact that I've put in 50 hours assuming the game went with the higher figure since it doesn't add them. I can't be the only one who finds it confusing.

Wait, what? You are playing a large strategy game with issues such as food supply, manpower, etc and you are worried about simple math like 13+50? Perhaps this is the wrong game for you then?

Level 8 Human Paladin
Alignment: Lawful good
Posted on March 15, 2011 at 4:38 pm

^ That. If you don't want to think, you're in the entirely wrong genre. :\

And it does add both numbers for you for a unit's morale.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Chaotic good
Posted on March 16, 2011 at 11:19 am

I'm simply pointing out that I found it to be a slightly confusing interface that led me to believe the two rows of stars were an 'either/or' not an 'and'.

It's not a big deal, but the human brain can instantly grasp small figures (1 to 5 or so) but not larger figures. As one pyschology text I read put it, we see things in terms of 'one, two, three, many.' This is how our brains are wired.

Obviously it's not a major flaw with the game, but nor is it the ideal means of communicating a sum to have two rows of stars that need to be added up by the player in his head. Conversely, the stars do look attractive and stylish. But it would be nice to be able to instantly get an overview of a unit's total skill.

Similarly, the four stats are in several places given without any identifier, just a string of numerals (i.e. 1/3/2/2) -- I keep forgetting the order of the stats, so I'm left trying to remember if the third number is morale or logistics. Again, it's not intuitive. Mousetips could be used to solve these problems.

Level 8 Human Hegemon
Alignment: Lawful good
Location: PA, USA
Posted on March 16, 2011 at 12:40 pm

I agree with Cherryfunk on this. While its certainly not a glaring fault, there is room for improvement, and several of the ideas proposed in this thread would work.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Chaotic good
Posted on March 21, 2011 at 11:33 pm

any words from the Dev department on whether or not they will implement more spawn points for generals in sandbox?

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