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Alpha 4, available now!

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Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Lawful good
Posted on October 18, 2010 at 8:20 pm

A list of everything I have found so far, a few of these things are personal preference, though.

Ability to disable camera rotation when clicking 'centre on town/location/unit etc'.

Ability to skip the following screens: initial splash screen on starting the game, Longbow logo and alpha warning.

Ability to delay the roll-over tooltip details.

Reduce music during cut scenes as sometimes it can be difficult to hear the voices.

Ability to fully customize all keyboard/mouse controls in the menu.

Equalize all in-game options music distances: 100%, 95%, 90%, 85%, 79% (?), 74%, 69%, 64%, 59% etc.

That's all so far :)

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: True neutral
Posted on October 19, 2010 at 3:52 am


Regarding the movement problems: I'm aware there is room for improvement (and it's planned for the long run) but I'm curious is this something you guys think is worse in the latest build?

With characters it is. I think it happens when you send a character directly from one city to another (PhilaPrincess and Callistratus to Pella) as opposed to a multi point path required for some longer trips. Some units get stuck as well. Nothing major but makes you wonder what kept them so long:)
I second the comment about the rotating screen switch off. I end up having to click north every time.
A4 is a huge improvement vs A3. Really, really good. Great effort guys

Alliances - I personally don't bother. 600 gold is better spent on troops that will keep your borders safe. And the raiding parties are a good source of slaves.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Chaotic good
Location: In my own little world.
Posted on October 19, 2010 at 9:52 am

I was using some sheep to re-supply a couple cities and when they were entered I got the message "Sheep have been defeated" even though they supplied the city.
EDIT: I saw some discussion earlier about invasions from other factions and I'd like to say that I'd rather see a few more attacks. It seems that the issue with AI attacks failing makes them launch 1 raid or small invasion and then stop. Athens, who I used to get an invasion from once a year hasn't attacked in 4 years. The Paeonians launched one devastating raid and haven't been back since. In alpha 3 the attacks were a little too often, but now they aren't enough to add to the challenge. Maybe there's a way to take the middle of the road in terms of frequency of attacks. Oh this is all on normal settings btw.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: True neutral
Posted on October 20, 2010 at 12:18 pm

I was using some sheep to re-supply a couple cities and when they were entered I got the message "Sheep have been defeated" even though they supplied the city.
EDIT: I saw some discussion earlier about invasions from other factions and I'd like to say that I'd rather see a few more attacks. It seems that the issue with AI attacks failing makes them launch 1 raid or small invasion and then stop. Athens, who I used to get an invasion from once a year hasn't attacked in 4 years. The Paeonians launched one devastating raid and haven't been back since. In alpha 3 the attacks were a little too often, but now they aren't enough to add to the challenge. Maybe there's a way to take the middle of the road in terms of frequency of attacks. Oh this is all on normal settings btw.


Yea I noticed that too, also I figured I'd point out that the lack of invasions/raids is indeed a pretty bug for Alpha 4, as I'm basically able to campaign now freely without most worry. Granted, I find this good for a change, since I can actually see the lands, and naturally figure out to put a proper defense down the line as my lands continue to grow, but right now it's pretty much just me campaigning, and no defending at all. So I do hope Alpha 5 is on the way soon since I know you stated it was already fixed for that.

At the same time, I feel that Alpha 3 raids/invasions just happen a little to much, and always seem to happen when I'd go on a campaign, which is most annoying naturally. So, to me, I kind a prefer a mix of what it was like in Alpha 3 and what is now in Alpha 4 as the ideal solution for the invasions/raids. No question, they should happen, but I just don't think they should happen as often as it was the case in Alpha 3.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: True neutral
Posted on October 20, 2010 at 2:45 pm

Also,

Another feedback note, since I'm now starting to scout out Illyria again, pathfinding around those mountain passes are still a major issue, and even more troublesome where there are supply carts around there, hope this helps. I happen to have a save of it, if it helps, just let me know and I will send it to the same e-mail address I sent before.

Level 17 Extraplanar gamer
Alignment: True neutral
Posted on October 20, 2010 at 4:49 pm

Ability to disable camera rotation when clicking 'centre on town/location/unit etc'.

There's currently a bug that's causing that to happen more often than it should. It was really only intended for mines or buildings up against mountains to ensure you can see the target.

Ability to skip the following screens: initial splash screen on starting the game, Longbow logo and alpha warning.

The game is still loading during the Longbow logo so we can't really skip it. Hitting Enter will close the alpha warning.

Ability to delay the roll-over tooltip details.

I could add a delay to the tooltips. Are you talking about the unit/building tips, the gui tips or both?

Equalize all in-game options music distances: 100%, 95%, 90%, 85%, 79% (?), 74%, 69%, 64%, 59% etc.

That's caused by a conversion error when switch from internal decibels to a percentage. For appearances sake I would like to tidy that up.

Regarding the movement problems ...

I found a few notable bugs when exiting from a city/building and immediately making a sharp turn or moving into tight terrain. This has been fixed an will appear in alpha 5.

I was using some sheep to re-supply a couple cities and when they were entered I got the message "Sheep have been defeated" even though they supplied the city.

We're actually looking at changing the sheep so that you have to manually "disband" or "unload" them in order to make it easier to safeguard them in cities and to load them on triremes.

... lack of invasions/raids ...

I found a bug in the Archidamian War where the AI gets hung up on raiding after a while due to some of the new factions not have all their ai defined. This should be fixed in the new build.

Another feedback note, since I'm now starting to scout out Illyria again, pathfinding around those mountain passes are still a major issue, ...

Is this with a group or single units? I'll play around in that area myself and see if I can identify anything particular.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: True neutral
Posted on October 20, 2010 at 5:33 pm

Is this with a group or single units? I'll play around in that area myself and see if I can identify anything particular.

It's actually both, but the save I have is just with my Companion Calvary consistently stuck by those mountain paths in Illyria (It also happens in the Balkan Mountains too, but not as bad as near Illyria). The easiest way to test it, is to send a large group, even your Companion Calvary from Pirustae to Doclea (since it has that steep mountain path in between), and you'll see the units there consistently getting stuck with pathfinding issues.

I also sent the save game that I have of the Companion Calvary getting stuck through that mountain pass near there, so hope it can help.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Chaotic good
Location: In my own little world.
Posted on October 20, 2010 at 5:49 pm

I just noticed that in the Philip campaign I can make alliances and you can actually complete objectives that way. If this was intended then super awesome!

We're actually looking at changing the sheep so that you have to manually "disband" or "unload" them in order to make it easier to safeguard them in cities and to load them on triremes.
Sounds good. Adds a little more micromanaging though if I'm sending sheep to a city with low supplies and I'm warring elsewhere.

I found a bug in the Archidamian War where the AI gets hung up on raiding after a while due to some of the new factions not have all their ai defined. This should be fixed in the new build.
Good to hear.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: True neutral
Posted on October 20, 2010 at 6:27 pm

I just noticed that in the Philip campaign I can make alliances and you can actually complete objectives that way. If this was intended then super awesome!

That's really awesome to hear if that's the case, since we can now take advantage of the better morale those units have as our allies, instead having them all mercenaries. (As it was the case historically with Phillip I think). However, as fun as this is, I really do hope that there is good progress into lowering the tribute costs for all diplomacy options, as since I've expanded my Macedonian kingdom pretty large right now, I'm noticing that factions will only accept truce in the 2,000 to 2,200 range, lol.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Chaotic good
Location: In my own little world.
Posted on October 20, 2010 at 11:49 pm

I know what you mean lol. I allied with the Paeonians to see what would happen and I realized "Oh no, I don't have enough slaves to fill those mines!"
And you know what I think would be cool is if a couple factions were slightly expansionist. Not to the degree that there is a couple superpowers on the map, but that some of the borders and army sizes shift around. I think that would be cool, but perhaps that's the TW fan in me talking :P

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: True neutral
Posted on October 21, 2010 at 3:01 am

I know what you mean lol. I allied with the Paeonians to see what would happen and I realized "Oh no, I don't have enough slaves to fill those mines!"

After 3 large scale invasions in the north by the Danube tribes I collected 6 full stacks of slaves. Thanks for that :)

One more question to Rob: will there be a change to the way the AI handles the new pop system? I've not noticed any difference between A3 and A4. The AI is still wasting a lot of manpower on pelasts

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Lawful good
Posted on October 21, 2010 at 7:51 am

There's currently a bug that's causing that to happen more often than it should. It was really only intended for mines or buildings up against mountains to ensure you can see the target.

Ah, ok, thanks for that. I find it a bit befuddling when it rotates every time you click it, and it makes it tough to keep track of which way is north :p

The game is still loading during the Longbow logo so we can't really skip it. Hitting Enter will close the alpha warning.

I didn't know that, apologies.

I could add a delay to the tooltips. Are you talking about the unit/building tips, the gui tips or both?

The GUI tooltips mainly but I will say both, as I find that it does appear too quickly for my liking, but this is personal preference, others may disagree.

That's caused by a conversion error when switch from internal decibels to a percentage. For appearances sake I would like to tidy that up.

Awesome, it's just a little confusing the first time you see it. Initially I thought it was my fault and it was linked to how long you pressed and held the mouse button down.

Thank you Rob (and the rest of the team) for all you hard work, I love the game and think it is taking really nice strides every alpha release.

Level 17 Extraplanar gamer
Alignment: True neutral
Posted on October 21, 2010 at 5:59 pm

"We're actually looking at changing the sheep so that you have to manually "disband" or "unload" them in order to make it easier to safeguard them in cities and to load them on triremes."

Sounds good. Adds a little more micromanaging though if I'm sending sheep to a city with low supplies and I'm warring elsewhere.


Like workers, you'll still have the option of telling the sheep to "unload" in a city and they'll walk there and be added to the city's supply like before.

I just noticed that in the Philip campaign I can make alliances and you can actually complete objectives that way. If this was intended then super awesome!

Due to a fear of breaking too many things we were limiting the amount of diplomacy available in the philip campaign. However, if it's a feature you guys are really interested in I can look into trying to integrate it better.

However, as fun as this is, I really do hope that there is good progress into lowering the tribute costs for all diplomacy options, as since I've expanded my Macedonian kingdom pretty large right now, I'm noticing that factions will only accept truce in the 2,000 to 2,200 range, lol.

I've reworked the diplomacy costs for Alpha 5 so they can potentially be much cheaper. You can even make money now on truces if your intimidation is greater than their hostility. I've also tried to expose more of the mechanics to make it easier to understand - this includes a new city intimidation stat (it was always there internally) which should help make it clearer how you can put pressure on a key city to intimidate an entire faction and drive down the cost of diplomacy.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: True neutral
Posted on October 21, 2010 at 6:32 pm

I've reworked the diplomacy costs for Alpha 5 so they can potentially be much cheaper. You can even make money now on truces if your intimidation is greater than their hostility. I've also tried to expose more of the mechanics to make it easier to understand - this includes a new city intimidation stat (it was always there internally) which should help make it clearer how you can put pressure on a key city to intimidate an entire faction and drive down the cost of diplomacy.

Awesome, sounds like Alpha 5 is going to be a very interesting build and looking forward to testing it.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: True neutral
Posted on October 21, 2010 at 8:33 pm

I already mentioned about bug - "Demand More Money To Keep Peace".
Athenian empire demanded more gold to keep peace, but after Count-down timer went to 0, demand still appears and no acction taken - I am still in truce .
Dont forget to correct this bug.

Level 8 Human gamer
Alignment: Chaotic good
Location: In my own little world.
Posted on October 21, 2010 at 11:27 pm

I've reworked the diplomacy costs for Alpha 5 so they can potentially be much cheaper. You can even make money now on truces if your intimidation is greater than their hostility. I've also tried to expose more of the mechanics to make it easier to understand - this includes a new city intimidation stat (it was always there internally) which should help make it clearer how you can put pressure on a key city to intimidate an entire faction and drive down the cost of diplomacy.

Awesome, sounds like Alpha 5 is going to be a very interesting build and looking forward to testing it.

Ditto!

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