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Let's talk about Nukes baby

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Level 11 Human gamer
Alignment: True neutral
Posted on September 23, 2007 at 10:47 pm

Let's up the weights yes sir-ee
Let's up the lag and updates of the map for every-bah-dee.
Let's talk about nukes...

Level 14 Human Shadow
Alignment: Chaotic good
Location: Earth Orbit, Preparing to Attack
Posted on September 23, 2007 at 11:29 pm

Uh, nuke = 1 crater = 1 sync needed.

Machine Gun = 50 craters = 50 syncs needed.

Nukes are quite friendly compared to avenger, MRL, machine gun, etc as far as crater syncs are concerned.

Plasma mines are the worst for syncing because they are transient, persistent, and common. Nukes are transient, but short-lived and uncommon (1 ammo each, vs 5 ammo each).

Overall, nukes aren't lag-inducing compared to most other weapons. While they are powerful and make big craters, in a game with 20 people, you expect them to occur several times per map.

--RC

Level 11 Human gamer
Alignment: True neutral
Posted on September 24, 2007 at 12:18 am

Still messes up the game to have them spawn every 20 seconds or so.

Level 14 Human gamer
Alignment: True neutral
Posted on September 26, 2007 at 9:32 am

something else to do...

Level 14 Human Shadow
Alignment: Chaotic good
Location: Earth Orbit, Preparing to Attack
Posted on September 27, 2007 at 8:23 am

I've never seen nukes spawn every 20 seconds. During a DDM with 12 people, we usually have about 5 nukes per round. But dont' forget, a DDM has intense action and lots of players. Nukes spawn randomly with a weight of 20 and matters with a weight of 10.

Weapon weights:
Airstrike: 70
Wasp: 80
Cruise: 40
Dirtball: 100
Drill: 80
Napalm: 80
Avenger: 80
Grenades: 100
Machine Gun: 100
Laser: 70
Concussion: 100
Mass: 60
Matter Bomb: 10
Mines: 100
MRL: 100
Nuke: 20
Plasma: 100
Swarmer: 100

Shadow doesn't matter for DDMs.

Total: 1990

Chance of nuke appearing: 1.0%
Chance of matter appearing: 0.5%

Now, 12 people each picking up weapons every 30 seconds on average during a DDM. That's 24 pickups a minute, or about 100 pickups every 4 minutes. Therefore, there are 1.5 nukes every 4 minutes.

DDMs last 20 minutes, or we should have 7-8 nukes at that pickup rate. If we pick up a little slower, maybe 5-6. A little faster, 9 or 10. With a couple more people, we get more nukes. Less people, less nukes.

This is stock DDM. Therefore the number of nukes is correct for a stock server.

--RC

Level 14 Human Sr Code Monkey
Alignment: Chaotic
Location: lost in the evil lands, of soccer-mom piloted minivans....
Posted on September 27, 2007 at 9:13 am

Actually, there are times when the random number generator TM uses clusters generated values, so even with a 1% chance, you may in fact have more than 7 or 8 nukes per round. Although doesn't happen frequently.

Other examples of RNG value clustering:

- spawning several tanks in the same spawn point simultaneously.
- continuously spawning at the same spot.
- weapons that ought to have a distributed spread of projectiles (like swarmers) fire a volley in a tightly packed wad.
- When using random maps, the same map appears several times in a row with the same mirroring.

There are more of course. These do happen with enough frequency to become annoying in some instances.

For example, my Armageddon server (not to be confused with the map of the same name) had a major annoyance of respawning the player in the exact same spot, only to get repeatedly annihilated and respawn. Again, in the exact same spot. Lather, rinse, repeat.

Level 14 Human Shadow
Alignment: Chaotic good
Location: Earth Orbit, Preparing to Attack
Posted on September 27, 2007 at 5:17 pm

Yes, TM uses the MS random number generator, which is far from random. I complained about this back during the betas, but it was never changed to a better random number generator.

--RC