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Author Topic:   Just so I'm clear on the upcoming clan match and player limits:
Irascible
Member
posted September 26, 2004 03:59 AM            
I don't recall who, but someone mentioned the limit of five players. That same person or someone else mentioned announcing the five that would play. The possible implication was that not more than five should show.

I frankly don't recall if the 5 player limit was imposed to prevent one clan from dominating, to save bandwidth, or both. In any event, unless there's a howling cry to the contrary there is a small chance BWL may have more than 5. Of course, as was the case in the past, only the top five would count.

Announcing the five would be next to impossible. I heard Par threatening to show. Glomund is often iffy. Venom may or may not show. I may or may not show. Sailor and Rex? About the only reliable player we have is Melon. So... I don't know who'll show. But if all the BWL players that could show do so, it will be more than five.

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=DNX= Matrix
Member
posted September 26, 2004 04:31 AM            
DNX has already announced its 5 m8

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=DNX= Matrix
Member
posted September 26, 2004 04:35 AM            
*returns with list*

Super, Bam, Ni, Coaxs & GMan

Our house is in order

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SuperUnknown
Administrator
posted September 26, 2004 04:41 AM            
Yeah it would be kinda cheap for one clan to have more players even if you delete the lowest scores.Those lowest scoring players are still effecting other players by attacking and slowing people down or killing them and forcing them to respawn somewhere else.Would be like having 8 DNX show and having the extra 3 go after Ras all the time =)

Though yeah I wish there was a better way without having to exclude people who want to play.In bigger games clans usually have their best players representing and a spot is something you have to earn.Though with this game being small and everyone can equally join and play at clan DDM's that kinda goes out the window.

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=DNX= Matrix
Member
posted September 26, 2004 04:45 AM            
Not necessarily, GMan is one of our newer members, he's getting the chance to play tonight in his first DDM - i have faith

I also seem to remember one match where almost ALL Dnx showed up lol .... various comments about unfairness were shouted around lol ... which i believe is how the rule came about !! by, err ... err.... OH YA !! It Was Ras ! lol ..

Was a fun game tho - totally enjoyable, we should have more unranked Melee's were as many show up as possible on their set teams - be loads of fun and mix the element in of the lesser skilled players taking part.

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Irascible
Member
posted September 26, 2004 06:47 AM            
I looked up the old threads on the topic. You're right Matrix. I did and still do want a five man limit because of the worry that DNX could deluge the battle with players. But having more than five and counting the top five are very different things. Weve tolerated the former with no problem up till now and have enforced the latter.

In the extraordinarily unlikely event that six BWL show, I certainly wouldn't ask one of them to leave. Active BWL is mostly older gents who have families and/or jobs. If they take time out to play the game, it often means they aren't doing something else with family or business. For them to decide to not go out to dinner to play the game and then be asked to leave would suck royally. Nor can we reasonably arrange in advance who's going to come. I'd never be able to get such a commitment because I never could even when I tried! The response I've gotten has always been: "I'll try to make it if I can." Our guys have too many other responsibilities in life to promise me that they're going to show up on their day off to play a video game.

So yes, I want a five player limit. But a rule is not just the rule but how it's dealt with. The bottom players were dropped in the past. No one objected. No one screamed about their being more than five. Remember the moon map clan battle? DNX had six and no one objected. We just get reminding people that the bottom player gets dropped. There's no reason for that to change. If there is, there needs to be proper discussion instead of unilateral declarations. And consider this: A team that fields more than five helps the opposition. If they did have six, the least skilled player would likely leave if you guys really insisted. But if he played, not one of his frags help us. His score gets dropped. But he'll add 20 to 30 frags to the other teams' score.

Anyway, it's very likely a moot discussion. The odds of BWL fielding more than 5 is reeeal low. Par threatened to show but I'm skeptical. Even if he does Sailor, Rex and Glo are not sure bets.

And ganging up on me? God bless it! Send them my way. My problem is that they run FROM me, not TO me. You know what Im talking about Supe. The more, the merrier. So not only is it not cheap, they'll enhance my score big time while some of their score adds nothing to yours because it will get dropped. It makes no sense for a team to gang extra players up on me. I'd clean up. And it makes no sense for a team to gang up on the least skilled. They'd get those frags anyway. The only thing that makes sense in terms of score is for a team to field their best 5. If we field six, its all good for you.

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=DNX= Matrix
Member
posted September 26, 2004 08:34 AM            
I set up a forum to discuss this sort of thing, nobody used it - remember - ok i know i look like im bleating, but really, the facility was there for AGES... its a bit late in the day to be pointing fingers now lol..... if you would like to see a private forum re-setup for this purpose, im happy to oblige. Seriously, i would welcome a serious non-explosive discussion/debate on this - but as far as I am concerned (and i speak for DNX as a whole), we use 5 players, we help no-one, a clan battle is exactly that... there are limits to what can be considered a "clan" here too, and its upto that number if they show or not (max is 5 of course), but if they show with 3, why should the rest of us pitch in ? Let them go out and recruit is what i say - we had to do it, now they have to do it... running a clan isnt a walk in the park and ppl should think seriously b4 they attempt it... when other clans start filling in players for them, a more relaxed attitude comes out where ppl are less inclined to put the effort in - id personally rather see a clan that has struggled and become good wiyj sufficient numbers, than see a weak one with a weak leader who cant be bothered because he knows the rest of the clans will carry his troubles for im and do the work.

DNX wont go there - sorry... but the scorring aspect, the dropping of players etc... yes, that would be a nice thread to be involved in, but DNX doesnt/wont carry anyone elses baggage. Put in some hard graft, and you might reep the rewards that come with it.

[This message has been edited by =DNX= Matrix (edited September 26, 2004).]

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pablito
Member
posted September 26, 2004 01:13 PM            
=CAT= will show up with 4 players

more targets to choose from

we do play for the fun of it

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SuperUnknown
Administrator
posted September 26, 2004 01:30 PM            
Amen,its all fun.I don't think we should ever turn people away who want to play regardless of the outcome.But clan wars are for bragging rights and I do agree something needs to be worked out in the future.But I persoanlly don't care if 10 BWL show =)

And Ras I hope you weren't insinuating that I run from you? =)heh jk.

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coaxs
Member
posted September 26, 2004 03:37 PM            
BWL should only field 5 players. You can't make the biggest stink about only allowing 5 people to show and then say BWL doesn't give a **** and will field as many as they want to. Whether it helps us or not, you helped make these rules and you should follow them. There are also lag considerations to take in consideration and I still hope if more than 5 BWL show up, 1 will drop.

------------------
Tread Marks Ladders

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pablito
Member
posted September 26, 2004 05:22 PM            
and don't forget all the after-agony we'll put up with the complains from people about being un-fair and such. Keep it as 5! if people want to play, LDA is open 24/7 or take turns... remember FL & CAT battle there were only 6 of us for 1 battle... what's the difference?
Keep it consistent pretty please??

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Rex R
Member
posted September 26, 2004 06:27 PM            
in the unlikely event that 6 of us(bwl) show up, I'll drop out. then read the screams later as folks whine about unfairness of it all as BWL takes the set and match

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Irascible
Member
posted September 26, 2004 06:32 PM            
I'm not sure where you're at Matrix. The help I was referring to was the fact that any clan who fields more than 5 will aid his opponents by doing so.

Yes Coax. And WHY was I making a stink? Because I didn't want DNX to dominate for the foreseeable future. You saw the old threads yourself. The primary concern was fairness. The answer to more than 5 showing, YOUR answer as well, was to drop the lowest score. I am suggesting that NOTHING should change. The past months have seen several occasions where one clan had more than 5, including DNX. The result was always to drop the lowest player's score. If that now changes it is a change brought on by DNX just one day before the match. That'll certainly be good for a few pages of "discussion".

You people are not getting it. My position hasn't changed one bit. It is you that are now proposing changes. And furthermore, what you don't get is that IF we happen to have six, that helps YOUR teams!!! Drop our lowest scoring player and he contributes ZERO frags to our side and probably 20 or 30 frags to our opponents' side.

Let me put it to you another way. What if Par shows and I ask him to leave? Are you going to support that? Is that "fair"? Pfft. All of our guys have to go out of their way to show. If six of them happen to do so, six will play. Only five will count. And YOUR scores will be aided in the process. If Coax wants to throw down the gauntlet and become DNX strong man, maybe BWL can "do the Matrix" and withdraw our score in protest (we'll have to throw in lots of angst over being disrespected too ) - or some such thing.

This is likely all academic anyway. More than 5 BWL showing happens about as often as Supe wins a DDM.

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Irascible
Member
posted September 26, 2004 06:34 PM            
That's good of you Rex. The thing I don't want happening is any BWL not even trying to show because they think they're going to get the boot. We have a hard enough time getting 5 there anyway. This sixth man business is only possible if Par shows as I thought I saw him talking about. Even then, Sailor and/or Glo are iffy.

[This message has been edited by Irascible (edited September 26, 2004).]

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Rex R
Member
posted September 26, 2004 07:04 PM            
I know I'm not the best player we have...so if I defer to one of our better players... I agree that it seems unlikely(just have to see who shows)

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666
Member
posted September 26, 2004 07:34 PM            
look....just show up and have fun

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Irascible
Member
posted September 26, 2004 08:32 PM            
No worries. Moot is was.

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pablito
Member
posted September 26, 2004 09:13 PM            
OK 6 of you but you got dropped so i see no harm

We do need a stronger server... ! use my pc if you need!

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-DNX-Ni
Member
posted September 26, 2004 09:13 PM            
DNX 2 out of 3! WOOT!

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=DNX= Matrix
Member
posted September 26, 2004 09:15 PM            
By all means withdraw your score it just brings DNX that bit closer to taking the lead lol ....

Also please remember, its Coaxs ladder... none of the changes were implemented on the suggestion of or by myself or any other DNX. He's tryin to keep it fair is all, its a good point youre helping other teams by giving them more targets - BUT - thats 1 more target that can fire back too

Time BWL got its house in order and started communicating rather than just hoping ppl can turn up. Not confirming this stuff is just plain laziness imho.

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Paranor
Member
posted September 26, 2004 09:15 PM            
Hey, who are you calling "older gents"?

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Rex R
Member
posted September 26, 2004 09:16 PM            
for me I can safely say the joint was jumping, turret, tank(s). seemed like mostly it was point and pray that the tank I was aiming at would still be there.

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=DNX= Matrix
Member
posted September 26, 2004 09:18 PM            
Good Going DNX - told you it would be a walkover Damn newbies can't even organise like a clan lol ....

So now were nudging up intowards 1st place.... oh its so close i can taste it lol .... KARMA FOR ALL CONCERNED

[This message has been edited by =DNX= Matrix (edited September 26, 2004).]

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