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Author Topic:   New Community Mods…are they stock… how about TM 1.6 cm1 for the name
666
Member
posted February 18, 2004 09:36 AM            
Now, there will be debate about if this is stock. There will be debate if this should be part of certain rankings. This is what every TM’ers been waiting for, updates to the TM 1.6. If we all support this update of community mods as stock there will be future updates and the game will evolve. Please, let’s just accept it and work on the next set of updates.

I am not going to debate this one. The community mods are going to be treated as stock. Folks need to download them because you will see them on all the community servers starting in March 2004. This should give folks enough time to download the new updates.

The server will need a name to indicate the update level. I am suggesting TM 1.6 cm1 be the name that players server host will need to put on their comment line of that comes up on the LDA link. The next community mod update will be known as TM 1.6 cm2 and so on.

The disappointing part of the community mods is that they download to an addon folder. So, I am going to put a pack together soon that will download them to the stock folders not the addon folder. It is unfortunate that there can’t be multiple addon folders, because I would have left the community mods 1 there. The main reason for putting the community mods in the stock folders is to reduce the size of the addons folder that goes through ftp to the community servers. And there is one less set of mods for me to remember.

The master flag pack will be another pack that I will add to the stock folders. It too is huge and is on all the servers.

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OH, Community Modded pack is out…is this going to be stock?
Race Ladder Results & Downloads

[This message has been edited by 666 (edited February 18, 2004).]

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=DNX= Matrix
Member
posted February 18, 2004 12:30 PM            
And how will this be affected by LDA's next patch (should there ever be one) if youre putting all this stuff into the main folder rather than the addon folder ?

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Irascible
Member
posted February 18, 2004 02:12 PM            
First off, get your grammar right. "…are they stock…" is a question. "I am not going to debate this one." is a dictate, as in dictator. You can't have it both ways.

Secondly, I don't give a mother friggin rat's @ss whether or not you think it's stock. If LDA says it's stock, then it's stock. If they do, then they'll add to their patch. And if they do, they'll add it to their stock server. YOU have no power to dictate otherwise.

As far as the comm server goes, do what you like. That's your little fiefdom and you may subjugate your serfs to whatever you like. The comm server is specifically there for the old timers to tweak with. So tweak away.

As far as ranked events go, they are stock unless otherwise agreed upon. YOU don't make that determination by yourself. I am not going to debate THAT. We've agreed to various changes in what maps are used. We have not agreed to the addition of this mod pack. If you want the mod pack in ranked events, then get popular support for it. You know, ASK.

The only thing as annoying as your assumption of power is your presumption to speak for others. Every TM'er has NOT been anxiously awaiting this. This is a mod pack. And LDA happens to have agreed to host it. Big friggin hairy deal. IF there is anything that "every TM’ers been waiting for" it would be a new patch. This ain't it. All this is is a VERY small slice of the available mods out there.

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=DNX= Matrix
Member
posted February 18, 2004 02:31 PM            
I think its great set of mods n stuff, but by definition, "mod" is not "stock" - "stock" is what comes on the cd as a standard install. To say it would be a dedicated setup ad that you must have the modpack to play would be more accurate.

Although i did put A's HQ pack into my stock folders, i did that by choice so that it would work alongsie my own anarchy maps and other mods.

Calling this stock, or "considered as stock" doesnt help new players - to them, stock means "ive just installed it and theres a server to play on"; but thats a side issue. It is as Ras says, a modpack that LDA chose to host, and as such, ill be lobbing it into an addon folder like the rest of the packs - the only files that go into my stock folder are there by choice, or by official patch.

No offense to Sailor or 666, but i think purporting this as a stock addon (theres no such thing) is a bad idea.

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BamZipPow
Member
posted February 18, 2004 03:08 PM            
Interesting...

I guess I won't be able to play on any of the "stock" servers anymore as I won't have access to download the "stock" addons or the master flag pack either.

I'll stick to my "stock" LDA missing tanks/weapons that weren't triangulated that I triangulated...

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666
Member
posted February 18, 2004 04:19 PM            
For the record, Sailor has nothing to do with the ideals of this thread.

As for the stock aspect, I can see it needs to be discussed as to what server will get the CM1 pack and which ones will stay original stock. I was hoping for a general approval, but it does not seem to be present.

The ideal of putting the CM in the stock folders of the community folder has more to do with movement of files, a logistic problem, which will not happen for now.

I do think that there will be other community mod packs. There needs to be a designation of it, therefore CM1. If you see it on the server "TM 1.6 CM1", that would alert you to which updates on the server.

Since Coax is in charge of the Ranked DDM, I will leave it up to him to decide.

The Clan battle maps are decided by the clans, whether they be stock or mod.

The Race ladder will have the CM1 addons.

The Stock CTF will have to be decided together.

The Fun DDM’s are what they are, mods.

Wait to hear from you all.

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coaxs
Member
posted February 18, 2004 04:38 PM            
Tread Marks Ladders will stick to "cd stock" installs of TM for ranked events.

Although, I look forward to downloading the cm1 mod addition. I still plan on adding it to my addons dirctory though.

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Tread Marks Ladders

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Sailor
Administrator
posted February 18, 2004 05:09 PM            
I agree that this is a mod-pack not stock in any way whatsoever. LDA Jim would add it to TM stock if he felt it should be so. It is designed to go into an addons folder and as such should be considered what it is a mod-pack nothing more nothing less. I hope people will enjoy it, but do not attempt to make it more than it is. My efforts and those of the other contributors is to provide extra content to be used by all who want to use it, but not to be considered that it will be on every server out there.

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May you always have a following Sea a cool breeze at your back and the comfort of those you hold nearest to your heart.
Sailor's Home Port


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Irascible
Member
posted February 18, 2004 09:58 PM            
I don't think anyone took it this way, but to be perfectly clear: I meant no dispersions towards the pack itself. Lots of people put lots of good work into it.

666: While I do make it my business to bust your chops now and then, it IS my opinion that you currently put more effort into the game than anyone else. Mods are hit and miss. The modders can choose to do them at their convenience. But the job that you and Sue do has to be done on time all the time. I would consider it a royal pain in the arse myself. So thank you 666 and Sue.

IP:

KONG
Member
posted February 18, 2004 10:16 PM            
awwwwww

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"My style? You could call it the art of fighting without fighting.''

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666
Member
posted February 19, 2004 01:42 AM            
Well, the ctf crowd wants the CM1 pack and it will be so. So that is the CTF and Race ladder that will have the CM1 mods.

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666
Member
posted February 19, 2004 09:19 AM            
Ok so we have it from Coax that the ranked DDM is strictly stock.

But what about the Clan battle. Can it have the CM1 mods?

Any comments?

[This message has been edited by 666 (edited February 19, 2004).]

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kv
Member
posted February 19, 2004 10:19 AM            
well, seeing as how the clan battle is a ranked DDM (I haven't seen anything that says it isn't), I would say no.

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=DNX= Matrix
Member
posted February 19, 2004 01:33 PM            
After the amount of moaning that happened following the hidden tanks ranked ddm - i will only play a ranked match if it is absolutlely, strictly .... non-modded ..... from the Cd ..... ** STOCK **

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coaxs
Member
posted February 19, 2004 02:25 PM            
Yeah, but the hidden tanks are stock.

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Tread Marks Ladders

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=DNX= Matrix
Member
posted February 19, 2004 02:33 PM            
The tanks ARE stock yeah - but look at what happened... ppl felt upset because they couldnt use said tanks - they haddent enabled them to use them even though they could see them. Enabling requires a downoad - download = extra files which is in effect a mod to switch ON the ability to chose from said stock items.

Its what id call a grey area.... but if sumthin so small can cause such a fluster - then its better we have no mods of any kind - that way nobody can moan.

IP:

KiLlEr
Member
posted February 19, 2004 02:40 PM            
LOL. Ah, but can they be selected in the game without doing anything beyond installing TM from a CD?

When I hear about a "stock" server, I expect that I can play on that server doing nothing more than installing the game and seeing only the items that are availible to me in single player mode. Nothing more, nothing less.

If the CM1 mods are added to the *STOCK* CTF game, then CTF will no longer be stock. Actually, the SSO modifications (mostley in the god file) that are suppose to be on that server was given to me by MexIndian, who originated the Weds night CTF. I would be against adding anything to it, but since I can't play at that time of day, my 2 cents ain't worth a whole lot. But quite frankly, I think only the fun DDM should be a modded event. Everything else should be stock. Ranked matches should abid by whatever the ranked rules are. If it ain't broke, which is why clan maps came about, becasue of spawn fragging, but from what I've been seeing in the stats, you have about 10-15 people at a ranked event. I don't see how spawn fragging should be as big of an issue now as it was then when there were 20-30 or more on a server (lordy, I sometimes just left after 5 mins of my tracks not touching down).

Even though Irascible got me PO'd about what he said about mods ( I know you didn't mean to do that Irascible. ), I do agree that if you call a server 'stock' it should be playable by anyone with nothing more than a TM cd in hand AND NO DOWNLOADS and that there should be stock servers out there so that people can play without having to download anything. But there also should be a choice of modded servers for those who want something different. Take a look at Robo's servers for example. There's one for every flavor.

Funny how these things flip flop all the time. When I started playing every server out there was stock. Now almost all the servers are modded in some form or another.
We need a balance.

AAMOF, I am going to be bringing back the original Armageddon server, which was purly stock maps and SSO. Since I've noticed more and more new players tryiong to get on.

[This message has been edited by KiLlEr (edited February 19, 2004).]

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Irascible
Member
posted February 20, 2004 12:46 AM            
Killer,
I've been consistent in my support for bending to the will of the majority. There is a small group of players who regularly play Wednesday CTF that compromise the majority of those that attend. 666 asked last night. So far we all appear to be cool with adding the mod pack. Compared to ddm map selection, CTF maps are few. A little variety would be nice.

Before anyone makes a misguided attempt to label my opinions duplicitous, realize that playability was my biggest problem with clan maps. Game play was severely impacted by all the extra spawn points with so few players. That's not a factor in CTF. You mostly spawn near your flag.

As far as what stuff "should be", why should CTF be stock? It is not a ranked event, so there is not the issue of keeping it consistent in order that the ladder tally be consistent. It is not a mass appeal event like the B-Day game, so there is not the issue of a bunch of peeps trying and failing to log on. There's just a core group of people that play along with a couple of rotating guests.

No big stakes, just fun - kind of like the fun ddm.

IP:

Blue n Gold Sue
Member
posted February 20, 2004 01:11 AM            
my two cents:
YES more ctf maps please!!!

Fun DDM - even if its semi stock with two teams should run the cm1

Everything else.. whatever

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666
Member
posted February 20, 2004 01:14 AM            
Well actually I was thinking of making it ranked. With Killer's logging it is possible to get all the flag captures and returns. Mind you, for a ranked event no AI's can be there...so...I guess it will be for fun for now.

The different catagories would be most returns, most captures, and most frags. Ras would take the latter one. It is something to think about.

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OH, Community Modded pack is out…is this going to be stock?
Race Ladder Results & Downloads

IP:

Irascible
Member
posted February 20, 2004 01:40 AM            
Ranked? CTF is a team game. Ranking individual stats is counterintuitive to say the least.

Speaking for myself, part of the appeal of CTF is the fact that the individual is NOT the focus. I LIKE losing my identity to the team.

But no worries. Even if you do end up ranking it, I won't hassle you 666. Maybe someone else will.

IP:

KiLlEr
Member
posted February 20, 2004 12:26 PM            
I think the only way a team based game can be ranked is if its a clan event. LogScan scores CTF by teams. In order for the results to be valid, you have to make sure your on the same team for all games comprising the event and not switching colors on every map.

Unless you make a 6 team, one person per team insanity CTF.

Irascible, no problems with a modded ctf from me, just wanted to mention where the CTF came from originally and mention that new players will get a black screen. If that doesn't bother anyone that is playing the CTF regularly (I did say that since I don't play, my 2 cents ain't worth all that much ) then thats all that matters for all that do play to agree (i.e. it's not one of those 666-esq commandments. tee-hee).

[This message has been edited by KiLlEr (edited February 20, 2004).]

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Irascible
Member
posted February 20, 2004 03:12 PM            
"666-esq commandments"

Yeah. We gots to avoids those. Hehe.

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666
Member
posted February 20, 2004 03:42 PM            
This has been worrying me also. I was going to do a post this weekend that will have the thread title, "Scheduled Events and Downloads". Inside the 1st post I was going to list all the events and post links for the downloads. I will pursue with LDA to get a forum for just info and links for all the servers needs, rankings, mod locations, etc.

One of the hardest parts of playing on a modded server is trying to find the mods. Hopefully I will be successful. Let you know how it comes out.

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OH, Community Modded pack is out…is this going to be stock?
Race Ladder Results & Downloads

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coaxs
Member
posted February 20, 2004 03:46 PM            
Wouldn't a website just be alot easier instaed of a whole forum for it?

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Tread Marks Ladders

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