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Author Topic:   Making Solid Things in TM.
Target!!
Member
posted June 18, 2001 09:52 PM            
Hi Everyone.. yeah.. Im still alive.. even though you wouldnt know if from the lack of my activity on the boards.

I hear that there is some pretty good feedback on the Tornado !! Im gonna try to see if I can revamp it a tad to make it moving.. but that is a seriously tall order due to the complexity. Anyways, Im glad that people like it.

There are other weapons on the way. Much Kudos to JVortex.. You Rock Dude !!

I have a Capture the Flag "weapon" in mind that is called the "FireBase". But to make it work.. I desperately need the ability to make a solid. Meaning a tank cant run through it.

I cant figure out how to make a base like the ones that exist for Statues. I need a solid that is wider than just a few feet.

JVortex has been helping some. But Im still not getting the right effect. If I make an obelisk that is about 5 "feet" high and about maybe 20 feet wide.. the tanks can pass right through the thing except for about maybe half a tank's width in the very center of the wall. That part is dead solid.

I cant figure out how to extend the solidness of the "Wall" to the full diameter/width of the Mesh I want to use.

Anyone got any ideas ?
I have already tried the Collide = 1 and the Mass = (anywhere from -1 up to positive 10,000) and same results.

Hope someone can give me an exact example of what I can do. This idea of mine would be a really cool enhancement for team based capture the flag maps.

Later all !!

(Poof)

>>TARGET<<

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coax
Administrator
posted June 18, 2001 10:05 PM            
can't you use the same idea as the Plasma Shield?

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Target!!
Member
posted June 18, 2001 11:09 PM            
Depends... I dont have the Plasma Shield so I dont know what it is. Guess i will check up on that first.

But if it makes a Mesh Solid so that a Tank cant pass through.. and you can make it as big as you want... then that should do the job nicely.

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JVortex
Member
posted June 19, 2001 12:26 PM            
the plasma shield is what i was telling you about w/ the sphere model and the scalematrix settings. go to my site and grab it off the weapons page. this does make a solid object. (sorry, i was thinking you already had the plasma shield for some reason)

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Target!!
Member
posted June 19, 2001 01:25 PM            
Already snagged the Shield from your site last night. heh heh.

Was taking a look at it before my brain shutdown for sleep mode.

Im not sure I understand how the thing works.. but My guess is that something "special" goes on with the game engine which will allow a exploshere to be "solid" yet most other classes cant ?

Im starting to think that the Statue Bases are defined as objects (havent exactly been able to nail down where they are defined.) And that they have a special property that a normal entity cant have in order to make them rock solid.

But, if the shield simulates the same effect, that will be good enough for me.

Will give it a shot tonight when I get off from work.

And your'e right J, you were describing the very same thing now that I look back through my notes of our previous discussions. I just wasn't putting 2 and 2 together. I was stuck on making a normal Mesh Entity become solid.. but didn't really pay attention to the fact that you were discussing the exploshere.

heh heh.

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peeeto
Member
posted June 19, 2001 04:02 PM         
the statues are set up in standard ENT files (...\Tread Marks\entities\Mesh)

there's a README file that explains some of the ENT commands. one command is 'collide', which is assigned 0 or 1. a value of 1 enables collision-detection for the mesh.

now, remember, collision detection is based on a bounding box that encompases the max&min x, y and z of your mesh. internal geometry is irrelevant. also, the TM engine does not recognize vertical collisions - only horizontal. this means that (unfortunately) we can't build bridges. yet (right, Jim? )

finally, the statue ENT file is associated with a map in the map's VED file, toward the end. look at any VED file with a hex-editor.

hope this helps... i'm looking forward to seeing what you're coming up with

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Target!!
Member
posted June 19, 2001 04:23 PM            
Yup, that's about right I guess.
What is bizzare to me is that I took the Obelisk Mesh.. and used the ScaleMatrix to squash it down and make it more in the dimensions of a wall instead of a four cornered pole.

I used the collide and Mass properties for the Obelisk.ent file thinking that I could make it solid. It almost worked.

For some reason, the "wall" is only solid at the very center. you can drive right through the sides. So Im guessing that one of two things are going on.. (maybe..)

1) TreadMarks doesnt like a typical Mesh ENT to be treated as solid.. but will allow, at the very least, for an ExploSphere ENT to be solid. But since my "wall" is being treated partially as solid.. I guess this is where your min/max Bounding Box part comes into play.

2) Im guessing that this min/max Bounding Box isnt really affected (much / or at all) by the ScaleMatrix property ? maybe the visible Stretching of the Mesh isnt really affecting the bounding box perhaps ? That might account for why the wall only seems solid in the center portion where the original Oblisk dimenions pretty much go. ?

Owie.. brain hurts.. heh heh.

I will just have to wait till I get home tonight and rip apart the Shield to see what I can get it to do.

But I would love to see if anyone else can take the Obelisk.ENT and make it any size you want.. and STILL have it completely solid so that your tank can not clip through parts of it.

Later all.

Poof.

>>TARGET<<

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LDA
Administrator
posted June 19, 2001 04:49 PM            
The simple answer is that there are a limited number of collision points on a "solid" object, so if you make it too large a tank will be-able to drive through at certain angles, and/or get stuck inside.

It's a limitation of the current engine, as we avoided larger objects anyway...(AI blockers), except when they were collide = 0

Try a series of smaller modules "entity-chained" together.

Jim

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GoldAnt_Number1
Member
posted June 19, 2001 06:15 PM            
hrmmmmmmmmm i know this sounds strange but i wanna see like a GIANT highway system level LOL. All water....... with 4 or so points of small islands where a road strencthcs up. This would lead up to a bigger area in with more roads.......etc now these roads would be floating in the air sorta so that might be hard to make. Tanks wolud drive around...etc Then At the top (From undeaderneath this might look like a cloud for kewl effects )A Giant hilly field, or somethingy like that. With 4 small buildings where the highways meet up. Now these wouldn't be striaght roads........etc They'd interlock and twist and wind around. Now this colud end up being a *Horrible* level. Or it might be REAL kewl. Whatcha think lda? would it really be that hard? and can roads (Highways) be made without the tanks bounceing around like on the plasma shield And if you guys released the Map Maker thing you've talked about before would it be able to stick pre-made mesh's of this hgihway island in the sky thing? if so i have some REALLY kewl ideas i'd like to try my luck on hehehehehehehehe someday ....................... weeeeeeee Nulcer shadow keepers!

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Target!!
Member
posted June 19, 2001 06:19 PM            
That's pretty cool
And a very sound reason I think too.
Im glad that I now understand that part.

I had originally tried just making dirt spires that are high but very narrow and then placing them close together. But they looked kind of uninspired (sorry for the pun).

Then I switched out the dirt spires with the normal dimensioned Obelisk. But I was afraid maybe that would risk creating too many objects in the world and eventually lag people out.

That was way before the idea of contraining how often the weapon can appear came to my mind. (the old Forrest for the Trees thing going on here.)

I will go back to that idea and see how I can get the size and number needed for my idea.

... Now if I can get them to "time out" after a while.. that would insure that they dont hang around forever too. So much to do.. heh heh.

Thank you very much for that responce !! I didnt even think my posting warranted any attention and I got lots of replies today alone. Very cool !!

Glad to see the board is alive and well. This place is so cool it's just silly

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JVortex
Member
posted June 20, 2001 01:36 AM            
well if TM is complaining about using scalematrix to stretch the walls maybe the answer would be to just make new wall models? would only need 2. im sure something will eventually be figured out.

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Rex R
Member
posted June 20, 2001 03:27 AM            
you would only need 12 triangles for each wall (assuming a plain chunk of wall)

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Target!!
Member
posted June 20, 2001 01:37 PM            
no no no TM isnt complaining.
According to LDA, its by design. And with good reason to avoid AI problems in pathing.

True.. a new model for a wall could never hurt. But care would need to be taken to insure that enough collision points would exist to prevent tanks from getting inside the wall segment or worse.. from getting in and then not being able to get out.

But that could be a whole new topic. Based on what size dimensions.. how many collision points exist. Not sure I wanna know. Brain hurt.. bad.... owie... LOL

LDA's suggestion to make smaller segments but chain them closely together will work.

>>TARGET<<

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