It is an alliance!

Sorry for the confusion. I feel the need to clarify things again, so that no one feels misled or deceived later on.

Basically it all boils down to this. TM has one active clan. To make another clan right now does not make sense to me, since most people who wish to be a member of a clan are already members of DNX. Forming another clan like DNX would not help much, because it would essentially be the same clan, except with a different name and different members. The policies and procedures would be the same, and these policies and procedures are apparently what's keeping these people from joining the clan. For the time being, if people want to join a "real" clan, they can join DNX.

Coax's "Alliance" idea meant more to me than a DNX-vs.-everyone-else match. The game was much more fun for me than a DDM, simply because of the set teams. I felt that a "clan" of sorts could be built from the ashes of this idea of "alliance", in order to continue the teams and add some poignance to things. This clan could/would be based not on policies, procedures, and monarchy, but rather on democracy, freedom among members, and a lack of set policy. A group of people agreeing not to be governed by anyone but themselves. It may be utopian but that's how I am, I guess.

And although the idology and concepts might be considerably different, I admit, Matrix is right. Even the loosest group of lonewolves experiences the possibility of becoming a "clan". But this is picayunish to me (picayunish lol). Whether it is called a "clan" or an "alliance" means nothing to me. The fundamental idea is the same no matter what you call it, and that is what's really important. Therefore, if you ask me, those who wish to call it a clan can feel free to do so, but those who wish to call it an alliance are also more than welcome. If anyone has other name ideas, I'm still listening!

Also, as far as I'm concerned, formalities (as in: practice, entrance requirements, etc.) don't even matter that much to me. As long as these formalities are decided on in the most democratic way possible, I will be entirely satisfied.

"Real" clans will come; give them time. We need enough players to have more than one active clan, however, and I think this "alliance" among us will help to give these future clans a jump-start, and I embrace this, rather than reject it.

...the alliance idea is cool, but IMHO there is definitely room for more than one (or two ) clans. the idea - again, IMO - is to spark some friendly competition... maybe DNX has grown too big for the amount of players the TM has presently, but we've tried to keep the BWL's size commensurate with TM's current population (Dreamer, Moriarty, me, Swisher, Cell, Rex R, Ace... did i forget anybody? ).

Neo - BWL is active... Not very active, admittedly, but we are at least productive. There's a reason why swisher chose to use the BWL logo for his prog, you know...

It's a shame we don't play, tho. Maybe we can change that in the near future, I hope that at least I will be able to play.

peeeto - what about your current project?

------------------
----------------------
Founder of BWL
Admin for The TM VR mod catalogue

I'm also a Dad (father of ramTHIS) but he's 19 and hasn't played much yet since coming home from college for the summer.

so, when is the next Unclan practice?

EDIT - BTW I like Sailors flag idea. If that get to busy, a single wolf foot print might do or a stylized wolf's head ala thundercats

I meant no disrespect or insult. I am fully aware that BWL exists. (I'm also aware that TC/MG exist, and even SVT hehe) But when I said "one active clan" I meant "one active clan" as in "one clan participating in or showing interest in clan wars". I didn't mean to undermine your activities outside or inside the game, so I apologize for leaving you out.

WM: You make a good point and although I am reluctant to be the "leader", it appears necessary. That's not so bad, though, I suppose. Better me than George Dubbya jk.

OK so here we go, looks like we have a tentative list of members here, roughly in order of signup:

• Neo
  
• Paranor
  
• Sailor
  
• Karldar
  
• kv
  
• Robu1
  
• Synack
  
• Vlad
  
• GoldAnt_Number1 (New!)
  

Not bad. Anyone wishing to be included/excluded from that list just let me/us know.

Anyone who wants to start wearing an LWA tag in their name can feel free to do so, put it anywhere in the name. Likewise, those who don't want to wear it don't have to. I suggest a few of us start wearing it just to try to raise general awareness about LWA.

First informal practice coming up soon, everyone listed above please post up your availability and/or non-availibility schedules. As for me, I work Thursday through Sunday 5:00pm-1:30am est.

How's about either saturday (daytime) or monday evening/night? Let me know.

[This message has been edited by Neo (edited June 30, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by Neo (edited July 15, 2001).]

Man, this is shaping up to be a formidable clan after all.

------------------
LDA Players, Information, and etc...

LWA could well be the biggest clan of the lot if all lonewolves decide to join up.

I must admit the idea of turning a tried n trusted method on its head and rewriting the book does have some appeal, but i persoanally feel that if all lonewolves considered themselves LWA / AOL / NATO whatever, then i think that would lead to more arguments than enjoyment.

True as karlday says i was airing an opinion, sorry if that offended but as a clanner i feel i do have some input here and i was only trying to help anyway.

W-man is also right in that weekly practice sessions and other activities are more the norm with traditional clanning, and trying to tell so many lonewolves about a practice session when they can come and go as they please with no structure could become quite the nightmare.

SVT needs removing from the DMF because SVT Hunter has been comp[letely unsuccessful in any recruitment efforts and has thrown in the towel.

TC doesnt wear the [TC] before the name so i dont realy take note of whom im fragging, i too agrree with sailor on that issue and consider him to be lonewolf in a game.

Dreamer is right because there should be more clan based activity in TM from the BWL team.

In fact everyone has got a good point to make, however reading the posts makes it appear that its going to be ALL vs DNX, which im sure you will agree would completely outnumber our active members until more players arrive in the scene and start setting up clans.

I dunno really maybe TM isnt a Clanners game, perhaps it is soley ment to be a lonewolves game - time will tell on that one, very few are willing to take part and put in the effort - and those who do and have, get my utter thanks in every way.. Thoise who want to be in a clan but not put any effort in frankly deserve to stay lonewolf.

The problem is that none of you have or seem to have ever been in a proper clan, so dont know what its like and are in no position to judge...... Can anyone here tell me DNX's entry requirements ?

No.. thought not....

Youre judging too harshly fellow players, dont diss it till u try it.

Im all for other clans appearing and clan wars cos thats what its all about - but if the aim gere is to simply outnumber DNX in ddms, then you can count me out.

Sure its a lot of fun, but hell a clan that aint a clan with no leader that anyone can join for whatever reason seems outlandish to me.

again no disrespect intened for the efforts i see here, but guys if ya gonna do it - do it right cos bullying should be left in the playground.

If you dont like it say so - all i read from coax is

DNX IS GETTING BIG
LETS GET DNX
WARNING LOOK AT DNX
IF ITS AGAINST DNX IM IN !

a guy can get to feel unwanted ya know lol !

As for the section just read where someone said nobody wants to join because of the rules you have to follow !

HAVE YOU EVEN ASKED ME WHAT THE RULES ARE ?

No didnt think so.....

I dont want to upset ppl, and im not trying to push too far, i see a lot of effort here and thats a good thing, but if it looks like dnx is getting ganged up on so to speak, i will have to re-consider our position in TM.

I wont add any more to this thread, ive said my piece, do what you will and it will be observerved.

Sorry if ive said anything here to upset, its not intended, all im saying is do it right - first time cos a thing without a leader has nobody to turn to, and nobody to dish out a deressing down when ppl are out of turn.

You make a number of good points, as before, and they have been noted. I have seen where you were coming from since the beginning and have been trying to modify my actions accordingly. Your point about a "clan" of sorts or even a "non-clan" with no leader is especially well noted, and it will not go without action. Weatherman's suggestions, as well as your comments, have led me to feel that it is my duty to lead the "clan" or whatever it is to be called. Therefore I have already assumed the leadership role. That is is not to say that others don't have input on things, but I am at least agreeing , when necessary, to speak on their behalf and make decisions in their absence.

I don't think the idea here was/is to gang up on DNX or BWL or TC/MG or anyone. I apologize that you feel this way. My original intention was to allow lonewolves the opportunity to take part in clanlike wars and give a head start to new clans of the future.

If any of the LWA's members are involved with the organization only for a personal vendetta of sorts against DNX, then that person would be more suited to form their own "formal clan" and should not continue to consider themselves a lonewolf and therefore should not be involved with LWA in the first place. I don't feel that anyone should be/is in LWA simply to team up against DNX. If it can be determined with reasonable certainty that someone is, then that person will simply be asked to leave the organisation.

I was hoping that the DNX-LWA relations would be very smooth so that things could stay lighthearted and everyone would have fun and leave it at that, and I can understand your concerns. I do not like how the DNX-LWA relationship has fared in the past few days, and I don't want things to get off to a bad start. So I will try to do my part here to show "no hard feelings" and an attempt at benevolence...

So therefore I'm gonna go out on a limb here and just take a POLL to see how many people would be interested in a more formal alliance that would be more acceptable to Matrix. This is not a change, it's just a question guys so please, don't run away. This question applies not only to current LWA members but also the TM community in general. Seriously, let's hear it; everyone speak up, who would be for a more formal clan and who would be against the more formal clan? Although I think we know how many are interested in the less formal clan, this will give us some sort of indication what the TM community is ready for.

Matrix, please keep in mind that this was all meant to be in good fun and as lighthearted as possible. I encourage you to keep a watchful eye on the LWA's activities, and if things continue to offend you or you begin to feel more uncomfortable about it, let me know via email or ICQ and I'm sure we can work things out to your satisfaction.

However, if it appears that the majority of the TM community is in favor of a loose clan or "alliance" as we are calling it presently, then I think that it should be given a reasonable chance to prove itself before it is abandoned. What's to lose?

For now though, I would suggest we all just sit tight and let things fall into place, as they have been...

I for one being new to online gaming appreciate both NEO for kicking this idea around and DNX Matrix for also giving us his experience with running a clan.

I didn't know there were other clans than DNX. BWL and some other one? So why join the only clan (DNX) is my thought. That's why I'll be happy to join up with other guys to take on DNX or the other clans (?) there are. I will definately join one someday. I believe that's the point of this group and I'm going to shutup now and play.

I just have a few more comments to add, I'm sorry for taking up so much of everyone's time; my posts seem to get more and more long-winded each time, lol.

I think you said it best yourself, Matrix:

quote:

---

Youre judging too harshly fellow players, dont diss it till u try it.

---

As with anything else, I think the idea should just be given its fair chance before it is discarded.

Also, Matrix, you are right--I am not aware of all the DNX requirements. However, I thought they were only fully revealed to potential members... I do not object to reading over DNX's requirements. If you feel this could be helpful and prevent us from wasting our time or efforts (or lack thereof ), and do not object to allowing me to see them, then please, by all means, send them to me via email.

Ok Neo, my bark is worse than my bite sometimes - i relent ur quite right it should be given a fair chance. Although Dreamer says BWL is quite active i do feel more members would be beneficial to them

Same for TC, more members more games.

Looks like u got ur stuff together, congrats on assuming the Leadrole, it can be tough at times, be ready for tough decisions lol.

i was only trying to hilight some of the pitfalls dnx has already been thru, you will understand more as LWA grows. In the meantime be assured that there is no bad feeling from our side and relations could not be better - i just like to make a point so that everyone sits up and takes notice. due to that, you have taken points mentioned on board, confronted em, and fixed em - so its been a helpful excercise if a stressful one.

See that down there - thats water that is .....

See that big thing over there ! thats a bridge that is.....

I think u know what im saying m8

c u in the zone

ps: dnx membership requirements are:

1) have fun

2) dont spoil it for others by cheeting and foulmouthing unless in jest.

3) post the members forum often and get in with the community activities - (we dont just play games u know) lol

4) play fair. and advise us if ur gonna be inactive so i dont take ppl off the rosters.

simple enuff huh

occasionally ive had to discepline ppl and check em out, but only 3 in 10 years - so dont fret it.

I was just worried that i would join a server one day and see 10 LWA, n theres me with my ikkle DNX flag on ! lol

C A R N A G E !

thats my only reservation - other than that good luck, i rest my case.

PeacE - OuT !

I will address your points in a later thread when I have more time to look over the posts I made about DNX.

Didn't like being mentioned in the third person though, even less in the first person

I talk and play with Superunknown almost everyday and he belongs to DNX so obviously I harbor no ill feelings to DNX.

Note - I hope this is a hallmark of LWA play - LWA players should volunteer to move to the other team to insure balanced sides. All frags by LWA players filling DNX slots are , of course , counted for DNX.
The Alliance isn't anti-DNX, it is pro team battles

2. Enough Jibber Jabber - less posting, more playing. I personally type more than I play and that is dumb.

3. LWA r00lzj00 or whatever

Edit: I will be on at 2 pm EST to destroy you all. I can only play 1 game (I am at work ) so lets make it good